If you were in your 50s or 60s I'd have hesitations about following a program like Hanson's, otherwise it's about having a strong base and being used to running quality workouts.  Despite Hansons statements, I don't think 30 mpw is a strong enough base for their training schedules.  Ditto if you aren't used to running as many quality sessions weekly. The intensity of speed workouts can take more out of you and require more recovery than a long run. You could probably follow a modified schedule either cutting back a little on the speed workouts, e.g. turning one into an easy run of moderate length, or taking an extra rest day when needed.

I ran for 3 years with all of my runs at about the same pace (slight increase in that pace over the years, but basically easy running all the time).  It helped my endurance and I did get faster.  Then, this year, I added about 1 quality workout per week and it has made a huge difference.  Big PRs for pretty much every race in 2015, and I just feel better, faster and stronger.   So I know I can do speed 1x/wk and it will make a difference, but the big question is can I do 2?  I will probably give it another week or two to see how it goes.  I hope I don't need to modify but I guess it won't be the end of the world if I replace one of them with an easier run as you suggested.

 

...Hang in there, we are all still are part of the running experiment. 

Thanks for sharing your experience with Hansons, and for the encouragement!

...

 

I think that if it is already difficult on week 5, there might be something to change. You don't want to burn yourself out this soon.

You can try skipping SOS runs, as some have suggested, but I think i would reconsider all my paces. If all your paces were 10-15 seconds/mile slower, would you still be laboring at the end of the week? If not, maybe an option would be to slow down your quality sessions a bit instead of skipping them.

 

I am not qualified to give advice either... just sharing something I'd try.

I hadn't really considered looking at my paces.  Thanks, I will consider that this week when planning my runs.

 

I am definitely looking forward to the strength phase!  

For me, the strength intervals wre harder than the speed intervals. YMMV.

The hard part of marathon training is that running becomes a huge chore where all runs are longer than I want to run and easy runs suck because my legs are so beat up from hard runs.  So then every run becomes "hard"... you have workouts, and then you have recovery runs where you drag your tired and sore legs along at a sad and slow pace.

+1

If you were in your 50s or 60s I'd have hesitations about following a program like Hanson's, otherwise it's about having a strong base and being used to running quality workouts.  Despite Hansons statements, I don't think 30 mpw is a strong enough base for their training schedules.  Ditto if you aren't used to running as many quality sessions weekly. The intensity of speed workouts can take more out of you and require more recovery than a long run. You could probably follow a modified schedule either cutting back a little on the speed workouts, e.g. turning one into an easy run of moderate length, or taking an extra rest day when needed.

This.

There may be other people here smarter than me who can say whether this plan is suitable for your history. But sounds reasonable as a way to take the next step to "get more serious" about marathon training.

 

 

Get used to it. Yes this is how it's supposed to feel. Wednesday will become your absolute favorite day of the week. By the time you get to the peak, just before taper, it will feel like your body is about break into a million pieces. Hopefully, it won't. Will you injure yourself? Who knows. But how the plan is making your body feel is not necessarily indicative of injury potential, just indicative of marathon training. Good luck!

I haven't done Hansons, but in general that is exactly how it is supposed to feel.

Well, that's the quandary for me.  My first thought was "LRB is a strong fast runner, he can afford to skip a quality workout now & then."  My second thought was "LRB is a strong fast runner, maybe I should do what he does and skip a quality workout when I need to!"  

My MRT cycles are 12 weeks and typically the first 4 weeks is 3 workouts a week, 2 speed, 1 long. The second 4 week stretch sees that drops to 2 sessions a week, usually 1 speed and 1 long. By the ninth week I am sick and tired of the whole fucking thing and ready to take up baking but I tough out the 1 quality session per week that I have for the next three weeks.

I'm not sure that I would classify it as skipping a workout as I usually will just move it by a day or two, or cut back on the length of the quality portion of a workout. So if I have 16 with 12 at MP I might still run the 16 but with only 9 or 10 at MP. That doesn't sound like much but it can make a difference.

There were definitely two workouts that I should have skipped this past cycle though. One cost me a shot at having a good half marathon and the other cost me my marathon.

There was a former member here who loathed the phrase "listen to your body", but that is exactly what I should have done the week before my marathon. Instead I tried to though it out and a minor injury became a major one, and I was left to forever wonder what could have been had I simply just ran easy that day.

Today ends week 5 of an 18-week marathon training cycle.  I had decided on Hansons' because I like running 6 days a week, I like speedwork, and as a slower runner, the shorter long run appeals to me. (Pfitz would have had me run 7 runs of 3 1/2 to 4 hours in 3 months).

 

Hansons' calls for 2 days of speedwork and a long run.  This was my first week to do all 3 and I am seriously doubting my ability to keep it up for the next 13 weeks.  I want a rest day today so bad.  Nothing is injured but everything feels just "off".  I'm in a panic not because I want to rest today, but because I foresee wanting to rest EVERY Sunday.  If I can't do the weekly workouts, then I'm not "doing Hansons".

 

It's only 4 easy miles.  I am going to get out there and run it this morning.  But - did I do the right thing in choosing Hansons?  Is it the right plan for this middle-aged penguin?  Is this just the cumulative fatigue effect they WANT me to experience?  Is it too late to change plans?  Do I even want to change plans?  Ugh, this is so early in the game to have all these doubts.

 

(so my log is hidden because of the game, but just as some background my weekly average for the year is 30 mpw.  I added speedwork this year for the first time and set PRs in 5k, 10k, and HM distance.  Oh yeah, and I've done the LA Marathon disastrously twice already, which had as much to do with the weather as my training)

The schedule should follow the athlete rather than the athlete follow the schedule. This schedule wasn't written for you and since there's no coach to monitor our weekly / daily progress you must apply some common sense and tweak the training schedule to fit our ability and training shifts. People want to believe they will automatically be better after following each workout to the letter when that is rarely the case. Don't assume that being a slave to a cookie cutter schedule is the same as being dedicated to your training. Recovery is the often overlooked piece in the puzzle.

So I abandoned this thread early; let me just catch up!

I figured out another reason I felt so tired last week.  It was my first week adding in a 2nd quality workout, and I wasn't really paying attention.  I was supposed to run 5 miles @MP, but instead I ran 5.5 @HMP which was almost a minute faster than MP.  Obviously this week has seemed much much easier!

Damaris, Sly, and PAD - thanks for the encouragement.

Lily, thank you.  But you don't need to unlearn anything!  In fact, I was hoping you would share the secret with me of how to drink a margarita (or 2) and still BQ.  

Ginny, I'll reconsider after another week or two.  I already feel more optimistic this week.

Moth and LRB - yes, I'm trying to listen to my body, not be a slave to the plan, etc.  It's just hard because I don't have enough training under my belt yet to know what my body is saying!

Lurch, with only 26,000 or so runners, I'm sure I'll run into you.    Are you following Hanson's Beginner?